Re: [RPPTL LandTen] FW: Security Deposit issue
body{font-family: Geneva,Arial,Helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:9pt;background-color: #ffffff;color: black;}Hello: Good idea, but I suggest that we NOT add this language:prefix = o /
"and provide for safe keeping thereof in accordance with the tenant’s will or written or oral wishes."
That creates responsibility and follow-up. It is sufficient to designate someone to take possession of the personal property. It solves the LL's problem and does not get involved with the future of that property- its care, safekeeping, validity of will, etc.
This also presupposes that the dwelling is not accessible by the designated person so that the person requires the LL's assistance. If a person has a key- you'd never even know the place was cleared, unless it is a building with good security . In any event, I do think its a good idea to do something- it simply goes a bit beyond an emergency contact designation. What else? a receipt/release when the property is removed?
Anyone may have valuable property in the dwelling-- jewelry, cash, stocks/bonds (Oh wait!! we don';t need to consider those as valuables after 2008....--- sorry- I digress...). If the purpose is to relieve the LL of responsibility- then its fine but I would suggest that the paper to be signed by the tenant make it very clear that the LL is not taking responsibility for the contents of the dwelling so the tenant should carefully consider who gets access and what is kept in the home. We can't control everything!!
I don't think this violates the probate process if the person isn't dead! And if the designated person happens to also be the personal representative- the per rep will be responsible for all of the property after death. Remember also that many people do not have assets that require a probate administration.
Perhaps------83.59 (3)(d) A landlord may obtain a signed statement from a tenant when the lease is signed or any time thereafter that identifies a person to contact to remove and take possession of the tenant’s personal property in the event of the tenant’s death or incapacity due to an illness that results in the termination of the lease. The person identified in the statement may remove the tenant’s personal property upon proper notice and arrangement with the LL.
Why don't we run this by the probate law & rules com'ees??
Best wishes to everyone for a healthy & happy New Year. Adrienne
Adrienne F. Promoff, P.A.
44 West Flagler Street, Suite 2100
Miami, Florida 33130
-----Original Message-----
From: "Neil B. Shoter"
Sent: Dec 29, 2008 9:44 AM
To: safrank@arnstein.com, landten@lists.flabarrpptl.org, "Meyer, George J." , mjgelfand@gelfandarpe.com, brutonb@gtlaw.com
Cc: "Arthur J. Menor"
Subject: [RPPTL LandTen] FW: Security Deposit issuev:* {
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If anyone has any comments on the string below, please let me know asap. I received this email relative to a change in law being requested by the Florida Association of Homes and Services for the Aging to allow the tenant while alive to designate someone to get the personal belongings in the event of the tenant 's incapacitation or death.Any comments?
Neil B. Shoter
Partner
Shutts & Bowen LLP
1100 CityPlace Tower, 525 Okeechobee Boulevard | West Palm Beach, FL 33401
Direct: (561) 650-8535 | Fax: (561) 822-5525
E-Mail | Biography | V-Card | Website
From: Mary Ellen Early [mailto:meearly@earthlink.net]
Sent: Sunday, December 28, 2008 10:25 PM
To: harry@evict.com; 'Jeff Rogo'
Cc: 'Janegale Boyd'; Neil B. Shoter; 'Carol A. Berkowitz'
Subject: RE: Security Deposit issueThank you Harry! Since I am not a lawyer, I am not familiar with this area of law. Therefore, I cannot draft the language. I am not working this week, but I will check my e-mail for ideas from you all. I want to use the bill slot that is being saved for us so I am working on another unrelated idea as well. We do not have a senate sponsor yet, but I am sure we can put our heads together and find one if this works out.
How about this concept as a starter? -- 83.59 (3)(d) A landlord may obtain a signed statement from a tenant when the lease is signed or any time thereafter that identifies the tenant’s personal representative or another person to contact to remove and provide safe keeping for the tenant’s personal property in the event of the tenant’s death or incapacity due to an illness that results in the termination of the lease. The person identified in the statement may remove the tenant’s personal property and provide for safe keeping thereof in accordance with the tenant’s will or written or oral wishes.
Mary Ellen
Mary Ellen K. Early
Senior Vice President of Public Policy
prefix = st1 /Florida Association of Homes and Services for the Aging
2303 Pin Oak Dr.
DeLand, Florida 32720
386/738-0503 (Deland)
850/671-3700 (Tallahassee)
From: harry@evict.com [mailto:harry@evict.com]
Sent: Sunday, December 28, 2008 6:24 PM
To: 'Mary Ellen Early'; 'Jeff Rogo'
Subject: RE: Security Deposit issueDear Mary Ellen,
Anything that helps us get possession of a unit as soon as possible after death is appealing to our industry.
The problem is that you cannot accomplish something in a document prior to death regarding personal property as this is part of the estate and there may be no estate opened up. In other words, you cannot bypass the probate or estate process. If the Bar does not mind, I am all for it.
As for incapacity, I see no problems.
I copied Jeff and let's run it by the Bar. I belong to the Real Property and Trust Law section of the Bar.
We need to explain the problem we all face, come up with the wording and have their blessing.
Jeff, possibly we need to make this a priority this week. It will help our industry.
Harry
LAW OFFICES OF
HEIST, WEISSE & DAVIS, P.A.
PH: 1 800 253 8428
FAX: 1 800 367 9038
"Serving the Property Management Professional"
Website: www.evict.com
Email: harry@evict.comTHIS E-MAIL MESSAGE IS CONFIDENTIAL, ATTORNEY-CLIENT PRIVILEGED, AND INTENDED FOR THE PERSONS NAMED ABOVE ONLY. ALL OTHER USE, COPYING, OR DISTRIBUTION IS STRICTLY PROHIBITED.
From: Mary Ellen Early [mailto:meearly@earthlink.net]
Sent: Saturday, December 27, 2008 12:13 PM
To: harry@evict.com
Subject: RE: Security Deposit issueDear Harry,
A house member saved us a bill slot. If we want to use it, we must have bill language to her by 1/2/09. Do you have any language to address this issue that will not upset the probate section of the bar? Could we add a couple of sentences to current law that says, In conjunction with signing a lease or any time thereafter, a tenant may provide the landlord with the name and contact information for a person responsible for removing and providing safekeeping for the tenant’ personal possessions in the event of the death of the tenant or incapacity due to an illness that results in the termination of the lease. The landlord may release the tenant’s personal possessions to the designated person.
Please let me know by this Monday if you are interested in pursuing a change in the law and if this language will work. We do not have a senate sponsor and we would need the support of the Apartment Association and the Probate section of the Florida Bar to make this work.
Thanks,
Mary Ellen
Mary Ellen K. Early
Senior Vice President of Public Policy
Florida Association of Homes and Services for the Aging
2303 Pin Oak Dr.
DeLand, Florida 32720
386/738-0503 (Deland)
850/671-3700 (Tallahassee)
From: harry@evict.com [mailto:harry@evict.com]
Sent: Tuesday, October 07, 2008 5:23 PM
To: 'Mary Ellen Early'; 'Jeff Rogo'
Cc: 'Gail Matillo'; 'Colleen Bloom'
Subject: RE: Security Deposit issueDear Ms. Early.
We had the same concerns. At the time I believe the amendment was proposed, we did not oppose the amendment because we wanted to get the bill passed. We were told that you were able to get possession in 15 days if federally funded. I disagreed with that as it conflicts with probate law but we just let it slide.
I copied Jeff Rogo and possibly we can address it.
We all have the same concerns with getting back possession without having to go through the time-consuming and expensive probate procedure. Maybe we can clean it up next year. I am a member of the Real Property and Probate Section of the Bar and on the Landlord/Tenant Law Committee this year.
Harry Heist
LAW OFFICES OF
HEIST, WEISSE & LUCREZI, P.A.
PH: 1 800 253 8428
FAX: 1 800 367 9038
"Serving the Property Management Professional"
Website: www.evict.com
Email: harry@evict.comFrom: Mary Ellen Early [mailto:meearly@earthlink.net]
Sent: Tuesday, October 07, 2008 11:55 AM
To: harry@evict.com
Cc: 'Gail Matillo'; 'Colleen Bloom'
Subject: RE: Security Deposit issue
Importance: HighDear Harry,
I looked up the section of law Jeff Rogo referenced -- 83.59 (3)(d). I do not have his e-mail address to respond so please forward this e-mail to him.
We had concerns about 83.59 (3)(d) when it was amended in 2007. A sentence was added for us to exempt HUD financed communities from the subsection because we were not sure the change would help. Most of our affordable housing members are governed by federal law. We are researching the process that they must follow when a resident dies and leaves possessions in the apartment. We know they have 14 days to get the unit ready for the next tenant. We don’t know if they can obtain information on the next of kin at the time of move-in and also get written verification from the tenant that they want their property released to that person should they die.
How would you propose changing the law? How about authorizing the landlord to obtain a signed statement from the tenant with instructions on who to call and what to do with personal possessions in the event of death? Can they do that now or do they have to wait for probate? I am not an attorney so I don’t know what the legal issues would be related to a will that identifies other heirs. When the law talks about a personal representative, I am assuming it means a personal representative named in the will. Do you know? Your association is more familiar because of the research that went into the 2007 law changes.
We are interested in the issue and would like to work with your association, but we need to do more research ourselves on federal law governing our HUD housing members.
Thanks,
Mary Ellen
Mary Ellen K. Early
Senior Vice President of Public Policy
Florida Association of Homes and Services for the Aging
2303 Pin Oak Dr.
DeLand, Florida 32720
386/738-0503 (Deland)
850/671-3700 (Tallahassee)
From: harry@evict.com [mailto:harry@evict.com]
Sent: Sunday, October 05, 2008 7:23 PM
To: Gail Matillo; 'Jeff Rogo'; 'Kelly Mallette'
Subject: Security Deposit issueDear Gail,
This was forwarded to me by Jeff Rogo, Governmental Affairs Director for the Florida Apartment Association.
Since you mentioned legislation, one issue that I deal with especially with seniors is the death of the senior in the apartment. While we can now wait 60 days and dispose of any abandoned personal property due to the law change 2 years ago, we cannot ever let relatives into the unit after a death unless a probate estate is opened and a personal representative appointed. Unless the senior is wealthy, no estate is ever opened and it really causes a problem. I would love to see some legislation that would allow a senior tenant or any tenant for that matter to designate in the lease or on a separate document, a person who could enter a unit after death and at the same time not have the landlord liable for what the relative may do to the personal belongings. It is a heart wrenching time when a relative flies in from New Jersey only to be denied access by the landlord. Often all they want is to get some sentimental personal belongings or find a will. Maybe we can all think about something like this and work together.
Have a wonderful week,
Harry Heist
General Counsel to FAA
From: Gail Matillo [mailto:gmatillo@fahsa.org]
Sent: Friday, September 26, 2008 5:03 PM
To: Kelly Mallette
Subject: 2009 Legislative sessionDear Kelly:
Are you planning to file any substantial bills in 2009?
Does any of the members of the Apartment Association ever have problems with refunding interest from security deposits?
We are working on our public policy agendas and I wanted to report if you were planning any bills, etc. for 2009.
Thank you,
Gail
Gail G. Matillo
Director of Housing and Program Development
Florida Association of Homes and Services for the Aging (FAHSA)
1812 Riggins Road
Tallahassee, FL 32308
(850) 671-3700 Fax: (850) 671-3790
Direct: (850) 702-0308
Cell: (850) 294-3415
LAW OFFICES OF
HEIST, WEISSE & LUCREZI, P.A.
PH: 1 800 253 8428
FAX: 1 800 367 9038
"Serving the Property Management Professional"
Website: www.evict.com
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